The RAMS Forum

HellRam wrote: ↑October 10th, 2025, 7:45 pm Colin isn't wrong. First impressions matter.

The media convinced everyone that Goff was a bust and his white kid from California persona made him not likeable. The Rams "messed" up by not taking "Wentz" the rugged white guy who played in the midwest. Ever since many Rams fans and media types never gave him a fair shot.

It's all ego. Nobody likes admitting they are wrong so Goff will go down as one of the most underrated players in NFL history. We live in a era where style is respected more than production. Goff is a Drew Brees level QB. Definitely good enough to win a ring. Does he? Lots of factors play into that.

ocram23 wrote: ↑October 10th, 2025, 9:39 pm

HellRam wrote: ↑October 10th, 2025, 7:45 pm Colin isn't wrong. First impressions matter.

The media convinced everyone that Goff was a bust and his white kid from California persona made him not likeable. The Rams "messed" up by not taking "Wentz" the rugged white guy who played in the midwest. Ever since many Rams fans and media types never gave him a fair shot.

It's all ego. Nobody likes admitting they are wrong so Goff will go down as one of the most underrated players in NFL history. We live in a era where style is respected more than production. Goff is a Drew Brees level QB. Definitely good enough to win a ring. Does he? Lots of factors play into that.

I had no issues with the Rams getting rid of Goff. Both sides underperformed. Goff has a perfect situation now and I am happy for him....But I am not going to fault the Rams for making the move

HellRam wrote: ↑October 10th, 2025, 9:54 pm

ocram23 wrote: ↑October 10th, 2025, 9:39 pm

I had no issues with the Rams getting rid of Goff. Both sides underperformed. Goff has a perfect situation now and I am happy for him....But I am not going to fault the Rams for making the move

I'm not faulting them either. I said at the time Stafford was the better QB who gave them a better chance at winning immediately.

But doesn't negate the fact Goff wasn’t given the time to develop. The Rams could have also had 2 1st, more cap space and a QB who was going to enter his prime.

Also, Goff is in his 3rd rebuild....CAL, LA and DET. The whole "perfect" spot narrative is sorta BS at this point. New OC and reshuffled oline and they are still pacing 2nd most points of all time. The constant is Goff.

ocram23 wrote: ↑October 10th, 2025, 10:49 pm

HellRam wrote: ↑October 10th, 2025, 9:54 pm

I'm not faulting them either. I said at the time Stafford was the better QB who gave them a better chance at winning immediately.

But doesn't negate the fact Goff wasn’t given the time to develop. The Rams could have also had 2 1st, more cap space and a QB who was going to enter his prime.

Also, Goff is in his 3rd rebuild....CAL, LA and DET. The whole "perfect" spot narrative is sorta BS at this point. New OC and reshuffled oline and they are still pacing 2nd most points of all time. The constant is Goff.

Detroit was in rebuild in yr 1 not anymore. they have been very good for 3 yrs

HellRam wrote: ↑October 10th, 2025, 11:04 pm

ocram23 wrote: ↑October 10th, 2025, 10:49 pm

Detroit was in rebuild in yr 1 not anymore. they have been very good for 3 yrs

Yup because of Goff.

Everyone already forgets in 2022 they were a top 5 scoring offense with Swift and Williams at RB. Guess who was the #2 receiver? Kalif freaking Raymond.

I mean Jamal Williams with Goff in 2022 (17) TDs. Next year without Goff (1) TD.

Guess how many top 5 scoring offenses McVay has without Goff? Zero!

Guess how many with Goff? 2!

Guess how many top 5 offenses Stafford has? Zero!

Guess how many Goff has? 6!

Goff has been part of 6 top 5 scoring teams while Stafford has never done it.

The more you you dig into this stuff, the more gross it gets.

I'll gladly admit I love that we won a ring with Matt. The dude can be a straight assassin. Incredibly fun player! But his style doesn't always put points on the board.

ocram23 wrote: ↑October 10th, 2025, 11:09 pm

HellRam wrote: ↑October 10th, 2025, 11:04 pm

Yup because of Goff.

Everyone already forgets in 2022 they were a top 5 scoring offense with Swift and Williams at RB. Guess who was the #2 receiver? Kalif freaking Raymond.

I mean Jamal Williams with Goff in 2022 (17) TDs. Next year without Goff (1) TD.

Guess how many top 5 scoring offenses McVay has without Goff? Zero!

Guess how many with Goff? 2!

Guess how many top 5 offenses Stafford has? Zero!

Guess how many Goff has? 6!

Goff has been part of 6 top 5 scoring teams while Stafford has never done it.

The more you you dig into this stuff, the more gross it gets.

I'll gladly admit I love that we won a ring with Matt. The dude can be a straight assassin. Incredibly fun player! But his style doesn't always put points on the board.

Brad Holmes hit a HR with damn near every pick for 3 drafts and it is not solely because of Goff. Gibbs, St Brown, Williams, LaPorta, Hutchinson, Sewell, Campbell, Arnold....these guys just crushed the draft and add that with great coaching and good QB play they have become very good.....team game

brasilrams wrote: ↑October 11th, 2025, 11:08 am Goff has been better than Stafford? Maybe. Still, one delivered a Super Bowl — the other didn’t. Also, I’m pretty sure Goff has had a much better O-line protecting him than Stafford had in the last three years. The Rams fail year after year to put together a top-5 O-line. Havenstein is old and always hurt, Avila is made of glass and kind of soft, our center is either Limmer or Shelton (both terrible). Alaric is decent and Dotson is good. That’s it. This O-line (yet again) is subpar.

They don’t f*** around with the O-line in Detroit — they know that since Goff is a pocket passer, he needs a top-tier line, and that’s exactly what Detroit has given him year after year.

Henry VIII wrote: ↑October 11th, 2025, 10:11 am The Rams biggest loss in all of this QB back and forth was not keep Brad Holmes under our umbrella somehow!..With Snead and Dumoff in his way. His path was essential blocked. So Detroit definitely won the battle of key personnel being employed. I don't know where he would or could have fit..but if we had kept Brad as GM or VP and Tony stay where he's at. I'm pretty sure my feelings wouldn't have gotten hurt if Kroenke replaced either Snead or especially Dumoff with Holmes. The dude knows football and has an eye for talent.

HellRam wrote: ↑October 11th, 2025, 11:47 am

Henry VIII wrote: ↑October 11th, 2025, 10:11 am The Rams biggest loss in all of this QB back and forth was not keep Brad Holmes under our umbrella somehow!..With Snead and Dumoff in his way. His path was essential blocked. So Detroit definitely won the battle of key personnel being employed. I don't know where he would or could have fit..but if we had kept Brad as GM or VP and Tony stay where he's at. I'm pretty sure my feelings wouldn't have gotten hurt if Kroenke replaced either Snead or especially Dumoff with Holmes. The dude knows football and has an eye for talent.

Lots of that had to do with the trade getting extra picks and Goff signing team friendly deals. The Lions 2024 draft is looking like a disaster. I feel like Brad hasn't done particularly well the last couple years. But overall he has done a phenomenal job turning that team around.

Henry VIII wrote: ↑October 11th, 2025, 11:59 am

HellRam wrote: ↑October 11th, 2025, 11:47 am

Lots of that had to do with the trade getting extra picks and Goff signing team friendly deals. The Lions 2024 draft is looking like a disaster. I feel like Brad hasn't done particularly well the last couple years. But overall he has done a phenomenal job turning that team around.

Draft picks yes..team friendly contract..no way Jose! 4 years at 53 per and 170 million guaranteed! with 212 million in total..doesn't seem overwhelming team friendly to me. Detroit restructured Goff's contract when he first arrived..but that was it nothing after that was team friendly in anyway..And to say Goff signed any team friendly contract deals like Brady did through the years is pure nonsense..Detroit's 2024 draft was widely considered successful, with the Lions receiving good grades for addressing their biggest need at cornerback by selecting Terrion Arnold and Ennis Rakestraw Jr.. While the team made a trade up for Arnold and a risky fourth-round pick of Giovanni Manu, the overall consensus is that they had a strong draft. Some injuries have put a damper on results. Maybe not immediate results but still a positive future.

HellRam wrote: ↑October 11th, 2025, 12:10 pm

Henry VIII wrote: ↑October 11th, 2025, 11:59 am

Draft picks yes..team friendly contract..no way Jose! 4 years at 53 per and 170 million guaranteed! with 212 million in total..doesn't seem overwhelming team friendly to me. Detroit restructured Goff's contract when he first arrived..but that was it nothing after that was team friendly in anyway..And to say Goff signed any team friendly contract deals like Brady did through the years is pure nonsense..Detroit's 2024 draft was widely considered successful, with the Lions receiving good grades for addressing their biggest need at cornerback by selecting Terrion Arnold and Ennis Rakestraw Jr.. While the team made a trade up for Arnold and a risky fourth-round pick of Giovanni Manu, the overall consensus is that they had a strong draft. Some injuries have put a damper on results. Maybe not immediate results but still a positive future.

Ennis Rakestraw has been on IR two years in a row and Arnold was demoted for being one of the worst CBS's in the league.

Do you guys just make stuff up? Like really lol.

Not one player from the 2024 class will be starting tomorrow night.

Maybe we should watch the games before making an opinion on them.

HellRam wrote: ↑October 11th, 2025, 11:38 am

brasilrams wrote: ↑October 11th, 2025, 11:08 am Goff has been better than Stafford? Maybe. Still, one delivered a Super Bowl — the other didn’t. Also, I’m pretty sure Goff has had a much better O-line protecting him than Stafford had in the last three years. The Rams fail year after year to put together a top-5 O-line. Havenstein is old and always hurt, Avila is made of glass and kind of soft, our center is either Limmer or Shelton (both terrible). Alaric is decent and Dotson is good. That’s it. This O-line (yet again) is subpar.

They don’t f*** around with the O-line in Detroit — they know that since Goff is a pocket passer, he needs a top-tier line, and that’s exactly what Detroit has given him year after year.

Not this year. They have Glasgow who is worse than Shelton and 2 rookie guards. Outside of Sewell the oline is very average.

Henry VIII wrote: ↑October 11th, 2025, 12:39 pm

HellRam wrote: ↑October 11th, 2025, 12:10 pm

Ennis Rakestraw has been on IR two years in a row and Arnold was demoted for being one of the worst CBS's in the league.

Do you guys just make stuff up? Like really lol.

Not one player from the 2024 class will be starting tomorrow night.

Maybe we should watch the games before making an opinion on them.

Maybe you should go back to the place where you received your Law degree from and ask them to help you better understand the premise of what a team friendly contract is and I'll watch the game tomorrow..
No, Terrion Arnold was not demoted, but he's not playing tomorrow because of an injury. He suffered a shoulder injury in Week 5..I Don't think an injury is considered a demotion. He played in all 5 of of Lions games this year..he did have early growing pains like a lot of rookies do Mr game watcher. And Terrion might be back this month after a second opinion.

brasilrams wrote: ↑October 11th, 2025, 2:35 pm

HellRam wrote: ↑October 11th, 2025, 11:38 am

Not this year. They have Glasgow who is worse than Shelton and 2 rookie guards. Outside of Sewell the oline is very average.

Glasgow worse than shelton ? WHAT ?????? Glasglow pass blocking grade is 73.1 by PFF ( 5 out of 49 centers ) , and Shelton pass blocking grade is 44.5 ( 38 out of 49 centers) . Shelton is plain horrible. Run blocking grade is better for Shelton but we are talking QB protection here , right ?

HellRam wrote: ↑October 11th, 2025, 2:44 pm

brasilrams wrote: ↑October 11th, 2025, 2:35 pm

Glasgow worse than shelton ? WHAT ?????? Glasglow pass blocking grade is 73.1 by PFF ( 5 out of 49 centers ) , and Shelton pass blocking grade is 44.5 ( 38 out of 49 centers) . Shelton is plain horrible. Run blocking grade is better for Shelton but we are talking QB protection here , right ?

Shelton 65.7
Glasgow 60

Glasgow is the 29th ranked center.
Shelton is the 16th ranked center.

Again, I actually watch the games. That's why I told everyone here Jonah Jackson was a bum. When everyone thought he was good because he played on the Lions. Narratives and facts are two separate things.

brasilrams wrote: ↑October 11th, 2025, 2:51 pm

HellRam wrote: ↑October 11th, 2025, 2:44 pm

Shelton 65.7
Glasgow 60

Glasgow is the 29th ranked center.
Shelton is the 16th ranked center.

Again, I actually watch the games. That's why I told everyone here Jonah Jackson was a bum. When everyone thought he was good because he played on the Lions. Narratives and facts are two separate things.

No, no, no… you’re using the overall grade for both players, and Shelton has a better overall grade because of his run blocking. I’ll go with the pass-blocking grade and my eye test, because yes — I watch the Lions. You’re not the only one who does.

Shelton is terrible in pass protection — hence his awful score of 44. Glasgow is pretty good in pass protection — hence his 73.

The eye test tells me the same thing: Stafford deals with pressure up the middle all the time, while Goff does not. Sorry but regarding PASS PROTECTION for the QB , Glasgow is not just better but MUCH better than Shelton. Case closed . Don't care about run blocking or overall score , that is not what we are talking about here . Now , we can talk about the rest of the o line and compare them but center ? not a chance. Also , it is not too hard to come up with the stats for the o line rankings for the past 3 years . I wouldn't be surprised if Goff had a top 5 or top 10 o line every year while stafford maybe a bottom 5 , or bottom 10 lol .mcsnead is McVay is notorious for neglecting the offensive line.

Goff has become a great player, but every time people compare him to Stafford, the quality of the O-line needs to be a big part of the conversation.

HellRam wrote: ↑October 11th, 2025, 3:23 pm

brasilrams wrote: ↑October 11th, 2025, 2:51 pm

No, no, no… you’re using the overall grade for both players, and Shelton has a better overall grade because of his run blocking. I’ll go with the pass-blocking grade and my eye test, because yes — I watch the Lions. You’re not the only one who does.

Shelton is terrible in pass protection — hence his awful score of 44. Glasgow is pretty good in pass protection — hence his 73.

The eye test tells me the same thing: Stafford deals with pressure up the middle all the time, while Goff does not. Sorry but regarding PASS PROTECTION for the QB , Glasgow is not just better but MUCH better than Shelton. Case closed . Don't care about run blocking or overall score , that is not what we are talking about here . Now , we can talk about the rest of the o line and compare them but center ? not a chance. Also , it is not too hard to come up with the stats for the o line rankings for the past 3 years . I wouldn't be surprised if Goff had a top 5 or top 10 o line every year while stafford maybe a bottom 5 , or bottom 10 lol .mcsnead is McVay is notorious for neglecting the offensive line.

Goff has become a great player, but every time people compare him to Stafford, the quality of the O-line needs to be a big part of the conversation.

The Rams have invested in the oline just fine. Outside of Center we have average to abve average players and even Shelton isn't terrible.

Tomorrow the Lions will be starting a 3rd string LT and a rookie RG and a first year starter at LG. And I bet they still have a better functioning offense than the Rams.

The irony is its looking more and more like Stafford was the one who needed everything "perfect" not Goff.

ocram23 wrote: ↑October 11th, 2025, 3:47 pm

HellRam wrote: ↑October 11th, 2025, 3:23 pm

The Rams have invested in the oline just fine. Outside of Center we have average to abve average players and even Shelton isn't terrible.

Tomorrow the Lions will be starting a 3rd string LT and a rookie RG and a first year starter at LG. And I bet they still have a better functioning offense than the Rams.

The irony is its looking more and more like Stafford was the one who needed everything "perfect" not Goff.

totally disagree. the OT situation is a total mess. they should have addressed this either in the draft or FA last yr

HellRam wrote: ↑October 11th, 2025, 3:49 pm

ocram23 wrote: ↑October 11th, 2025, 3:47 pm

totally disagree. the OT situation is a total mess. they should have addressed this either in the draft or FA last yr

A mess? Jackson is one of the better LT in the league.

As for Hav, the dude is a staple but I agree that his tenure is coming to an end sooner than later.

HellRam wrote: ↑October 11th, 2025, 3:23 pm

brasilrams wrote: ↑October 11th, 2025, 2:51 pm

No, no, no… you’re using the overall grade for both players, and Shelton has a better overall grade because of his run blocking. I’ll go with the pass-blocking grade and my eye test, because yes — I watch the Lions. You’re not the only one who does.

Shelton is terrible in pass protection — hence his awful score of 44. Glasgow is pretty good in pass protection — hence his 73.

The eye test tells me the same thing: Stafford deals with pressure up the middle all the time, while Goff does not. Sorry but regarding PASS PROTECTION for the QB , Glasgow is not just better but MUCH better than Shelton. Case closed . Don't care about run blocking or overall score , that is not what we are talking about here . Now , we can talk about the rest of the o line and compare them but center ? not a chance. Also , it is not too hard to come up with the stats for the o line rankings for the past 3 years . I wouldn't be surprised if Goff had a top 5 or top 10 o line every year while stafford maybe a bottom 5 , or bottom 10 lol .mcsnead is McVay is notorious for neglecting the offensive line.

Goff has become a great player, but every time people compare him to Stafford, the quality of the O-line needs to be a big part of the conversation.

The Rams have invested in the oline just fine. Outside of Center we have average to abve average players and even Shelton isn't terrible.

Tomorrow the Lions will be starting a 3rd string LT and a rookie RG and a first year starter at LG. And I bet they still have a better functioning offense than the Rams.

The irony is its looking more and more like Stafford was the one who needed everything "perfect" not Goff.

ramsrule57 wrote: ↑October 11th, 2025, 4:31 pm Except winning a Superbowl...................

And until he does he isn't "better" than MS. And I think he is playing at top 5 level right now, still means nothing, not when only 1 team gets to be champ every year and his hasn't been..........yet.